HomeMy WebLinkAboutCorrespondance, North Boulder Recreation Center Lap Poolprom: "Kelly, Steve" <steve kelly@i~nedient com>
To: "'7acksong@ci boulder co.us'" <7acksong@ci.boulder
~~ Dato: 9/12/00 9:39am
3ubiact: NBRC Swim Remodel
Dear Ms. Jackson,
I am writing to e~cpress my interest in expanding rather than curtailing the
number of swim lanes at NBRC. I don't currently participate in any Masters
program, but I do en7oy open lane swimming. I encourage the Parks 6
Recreation Board and City Council to think about the growing population and
traffic congestion in Boulder when evaluating proposals for the tvsRC
remodel I readily support expansion of the NBRC pool facility to a SOx25
facility that will support the demand for swimming well into the future
Thank you for your tvne
steve
Prom: Jeff Bennett <7bennett@casa colorado edu>
To: <RiederReal@aol com>
Data: 9/13/00 9 54am °'^
Subject: Re North Boulder Rec Center Renovation
Hi Kevin,
Thanks for your message The best thing for you to do would be to send your
message to the Park and Rec board members, which you can do by sending an
e-mail to Georgia Jackson at 7acksong@ci boulder co us, she will then
distribute the e-mail to all P&R board members
Thanks
Jeff
>Dear Jeff-
>
>I received an e-mail from Carol and Chuck Semple about the future plans for
>the North Boulder Rec Center and specifically the pool area renovation Over
>the years I have swam both with the masters and on my own and I will tell you
>that at the very least the pool should be left in an "as-is condition" The
>idea of reducing the number of lanes appalls me If any thing the future
>growth and use of the center should be taken into account and the idea of
>expanding the pool makes much more sense to me
>
>Another issue that Z feel is important is, what I consider the gross underuse
>of the city's outdoor pool facilities Spruce pool was open all of 2 5
>months this year, I believe it could easily be used right now for at least
>7-8 months and if the right type of temporary cover (bubble) where used it
>could be used all year The same goes foz Scott Carpentar
>
>My profession is commezcial development and I see the excise taxes and the
>propezty taxes and sales tax that we all pay to live in this wonderful city '~
>where the city government has one of the highest per capita budgets in the
>country and i fail to understand the reasoning behind the proposed cuts that
>2 am hearing about or the lack of staffing ability The usership is in place
>and I believe its important to provide all who live here with the best
>facilities and service possilbe
>
>D Kevin Rieder
######################k###RR##########RRN#########
Jeff Bennett
7bennett@casa colorado edu
http //casa colorado edu/-7bennett
###############################################k##
..~.
From: Tracie Holcomb <tracie holcomb@requisite com>
To: "'7acksong@ci boulder co.us'" <7acksong@ci boulder
~""* nate: 9/9/00 5:37pm
,,,,, Subject: North Boulder Rec Centez
.,,,
r
~
Dear Parks and Rec Board,
I would first like to express my delight that you are moving forward to
renovations at the NSRC. As it is, by far, the closest rec center to my
house (820 Union Ave), I am very interested in the plans to expand and
renovate the center I understand that BAM has expressed the desire to
expand the current swimming pool and in particular the lap lanes to
accommodate their practices. I am not a member of BAM, but I do en~oy
swimming laps and often travel to EBRC because the swimming facilities are
so far superior to those at NBRC I hope you will consider the wishes of ine
and many others like me to add as many additional lap lanes as possible at
NBRC
Thanks for your consideration,
Tracie Holcomb
North Boulder Resident
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Thank you
~.r
From: ^Matt Brown^ <kofidog@hotmail com>
To: <~acksong@ci.boulder co us> ~
Date: 9/11/00 8 59am
Subiect: North Bldr Rec Center
Dear Georgia,
I am writing concerning the renovation to the N Bldr Rec Center, and
specifically the issue of the pool I live "around the corner" on Lloyd
Circle and would love to see more swim lanes at the pool I hear there is a
potential conflict over a slide for teenagers and swim lanes for swimmers
My thought is teenagers these days need more than a slide to keep them
occupied, and that there are many Cax paying citizens, like myself, who
would love to see more swim lanes at my regional Rec Center
Thanks for your concern,
Matt Brown
Lloyd Circle
Boulder. CO 80304
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From: Jeff Bennett <~bennett@casa.colorado edu>
To: <7acksong@ci boulder co us>
~F` Date: 9/8/00 3 Olpm
a.. Subject: NBRC Pools, please distribute to P/R Board and City Council
Dear Parks and Recreation Board Members
I'd like to thank all of you for giving me the time to speak at your
meeting on Wednesday night I've been thinking further about the nature of
the decision you face, and would like to add a few more thoughts Many of
the issues we discussed with regard to the NRBC pool remodel are important
Take the traffic issue, for example Z ~ust returned from a Masters swim
session at EBRC, where 13 of the 31 adults participating in today's noon
session had driven across town to get there (including myself), despite
living much closer to NBRC Similarly, there are the important health and
safety issues of adequate fresh air ventilation and acoustics that will
allow swim instructors and lifeguards to be heard when they speak
But by far your most important decision has to do with the number of lanes
for lap swi~ning Once the pool is built, Boulder's citizens will be living
with it for at least the next 10 to 20 years, and probably much longer,
before another remodel can be undertaken So I ask you to think hard about
how your decisions today will look from a vantage point 10 to 20 years in
the future
Anyone with a young child knows that Boulder is in the midst of a local
baby boom Within 7ust a few years, many these children will be looking for
the guidance and structure provided by youth swim programs Later, some of
them may wish to participate in competitive programs in high school or U.S
swimming Meanwhile, whether we like it or not, Boulder continues to grow
~...
rapidly. The number of adults participating in Masters swimming has nearly
"/ doubled in the past decade Already, the City pools are unable to
accomodate the demand for youth and adult swim programs So, as Z see it,
your choices today will be looked back upon in one of three ways
1 If you leave the current NBRC plan, which reduces the number of lanes at
NBRC to 5 from its current 6, Boulder's citizens of the future will wonder
why you didn't find their swim programs important enough to preserve in
even their current state, let alone to improve
2 If you maintain the status quo of 6 lanes, Boulder's citizens of the
futuze will wonder why you passed up a once-in-a-generation opportunity to
improve a bad situation.
3 If you increase the number of lanes to 8 or more, Boulder's citizens of
the future will thank you for caring about the places where they and their
children can swim. Although staying in budget will mean reducing the size
of the leisure pool, remember that leisure pools may prove to be a passing
fad, while SWIMMING pools are here to stay
Finally, I'd like to point out that while 6 lanes will alleviate the
immediate squeeze on Boulder's swim space, the growing population will
ensure that the squeeze returns within a few years Therefore I'd like to
ask you to consider a truly visionary solution to Boulder's swim problems
It would cost somewhat more, but it would for the first time provide
Boulder with a swim facilitly up to the standards found in places like
Colorado Springs, Denver, Ft Collins, and throughout Califoxnia
~
With a bit of creativity in redesigning the west side of the new NBRC, you
actually have enough room to puC in a single pool, 50 meters long by 25
yards wide Such a pool could accommodate 24 lanes of short-course ,
(25-yard) swimming --- making it big enough to SIMULTANEOUSLY host a youth
swim club, a Masters workout, community open swim lanes, and a play area
with as many slides as you wish During certain hours of the day, it can be
used for 50-meter swimming, for the first time giving Boulder's youth a
place where they can train at competiton distance year-round (currently
this is possible only during the summer at Scott Carpenter).
In fact, because of the demand for swimming, it is inevitable that such a
SOx25 facility will even[ually be built in Boulder, perhaps out at the
Valmont property, or perhaps by a private group on land east of the city
So remember this A quick glance at a Boulder city map shows that NBRC is
by far the most centrally-located recreation center If the eventual big
swim facility goes to the east, it will mean more driving, more congestion.
So why not make the decision now, before it is too late Is it too
visionary to build such a SOx25 pool at NBRC~ The answer depends on how far
into the future you are willing to look
Thank you for your time If any of you would like to speak with me further
about these issues, please feel free to call me at 303-440-9313
Jeff Bennett
########################R##############k##kR#R####
Jeff Bennett
7bennett@casa colorado.edu
http //casa colorado edu/-7bennett
#######################R######RqR#################
~
CC: <COUncil@ci boulder co us>
From: Fran Sheets <sheetsf@spot colorado edu>
To: <7acksong@ci boulder co us>
'R Date: 9/9/00 5 49pm
~
BOULDER AQOATIC MASTER
PO BOX 2016
BOULDER, CO 80306-2016
September 7, 2000
Parks and Recreation Advisory Board
P O Box 791
Boulder, Co 80306
Dear Boazd Members,
Thank you for your patience in allowing so many of our Master's members to
speak at your meeting last night. We'd like to take this opportunity to
briefly summarize our recommendations
1) The city's #1 pool problem is lack of lane space Rather than reducing
the current 6 lanes to 5, it should be increased to 8, so that the pool can
accommodate a swim program
(youth, high school, master's) while still leaving open lanes for lap
swimmers It will also ensure that the nearly 100 North area Master's
swimmers will not be forced to drive across town for all their workouts
2) The increased number of lanes should be done with little or no increase
'"' in total facility cost by asking the architects to think "outside the box"
.,,r represented by the current pool configuration. Namely
Creatively think about ALL the space on the west side of the building
concept, including the spaces for both pools, the sun deck and landscaping
The leisure pool does not need to be as large as planned, given the fact
that the north area already has a public leisure pool at Mapleton.
If the cost of an 8 lane pool is deemed to be an issue, perhaps
compromises can be made in other areas of the facility For instance,
expensive sandstone walls and architectural beams in the lobby could be
eliminated in favor of putting that money into better facilities, which is
the first priority for the rec center
3) The city must address the serious health issues related to adequate
ventilation Both leisure pools and hot tubs present known health hazards
that can only be alleviated by circulating fresh, outside air The
ventilation solutions should also include doors and windows that can be
opened to that the pool has a"BOUlder" feel, not a dungeon feel
4) The architecture should take into account acoustic considerations in the
pool area, in order to prevent the type of problems that exist at EBRC,
where coaches and swim teachers cannot be heard by their clients
5) In principle, we also support the suggestion of making the pool 25
meters rather than 25 yards, however, this is a MUCH lower priority than an
increased number of lanes
6) BAM supports the ramp entrance to the lap pool to improve access for all
citizens We are svre it can be designed without impacting the numbez of
lanes
~) BAM opposes the drop slide entering the lap pool Aside from adding
cost for (for a slide as well as a 12-foot deep pool, which is not needed
for lap swimming) a feature of far less value to teenagers than a real swim
program, it makes lap swimming near-impossible during the times when it is
open
In sum, we urge the board to give direction to the department and
architects to revise the plans to incorporate these recommendations
Thanking you again
The BAM Board
cc city council
Kris Dropinski
Linda Katowski
CC: <council@ci boulder.co us>, <dropinskik@ci boulder
~^~+,
From: "Smith, Chris" <Chris Smith@am sony com>
To: "'7acksong@ci boulder co us'" <7acksong@ci boulder .
,~, Date: 9/8/00 4 39pm
Subiect: pools in boulder
,~..
Hello.
I am writing as a non-master swimmer although I have worked out with the
group several times over the years as a drop in I have a background of
competitive swimming and continue to use the Boulder pools with my family
Aave been swimming primarily in NBRC since 1982, although normally have used
EBRC since it was built It appears that there is room to submit opinions,
so here is mine
When one is swimming for exercise in a typical circular pattern within a
lane, it is important to have enough lanes so swimmers of varying degrees of
speed can match up with each other Passing in a single lane is difficult
As the masters are saying, more lanes are better~
Over the past couple of years, at least when i seem to be there, the
NBOUlder pool is divided into one or two lap lanes on the west, with the
rest cut in half east-west to divide the diving azea from the recreational
area This makes a workout quite difficult since all levels are in the same
lane I usually give up
What I would really like to see in ouz pool designs are extra wide outer
lanes where a lane line can be added next to the wall, with a gutter along
the length This is how most competition pools are built and serves well to
reduce side wave reflections, making racing against the center lanes more
equal and water conditions duzing practices more predictable
That's my 2 cents worth
Chris Smith
Business Development Mgr
SONY Data Recording Media
Boulder, CO
Ph 303 415 5911
email. chris smith@am.sony com
CC: "'COUncil@ci boulder co us '" <COUncil@ci boulder
.~
From: "Mike Ellis (denver)" <mike ellis@tvguide.com>
To: <7acksong@ci.boulder.co us>
,,,,, nata: 9/13/00 7 02pm
3ubject: NBRC Improvements
Georgia,
i received your name and email address from other interested parties in
regard to the proposed upgrades at the North Boulder Recreation Center I
am glad to have a contact name on this issue, and hope that you will pass on
my comments to any other appropriate parties on the Parks and Rec Board and
other bodies that are involved in the design, review, and approval of the
proposed changes
When I learned a year and a half ago that the NBRC was to be upgraded I was
cautiously optimistic. Living about 3/4 mile north of there, it is my
"home" rec center After seeing the good and bad things Chat were done at
the East and South upgrades, I was hoping for a chance to provide some
feedback
My wife and I are 20 year Boulder residents, and both have annual recreation
passes, on which we've spent close to $700/year (5485 for one masters annual
pass, plus $192.50 on my wife's half price pass ) I'll have to admit that
we both pzobably use the SBRC most often, because of various inadequacies of
the North center. It's nice to have good facilities available, but it would
be great to have "world-class" facilities available in our neighborhood,
especially given Boulder's athletic population.
My wife mostly uses the cardiovascular equipment for fitness She does not
ever go to the North center currently, because of the small space, limited
.~,. availability of equipment, and poorly maintained state of the equipment I
also generally try to find alternatives to the cardio and weight equipment
'~ at NBRC for similar reasons, and usually end up at non-city facilities. We
are hopeful that with the new design additional space and equipment will be
available, and that it will be adequately maintained
Much of my use of the rec centers is in Masters Swimming and lap swimming.
Given the size of the masters swimming program in Boulder, the number of lap
swimmers, the number of other swimming programs, and the constant struggle
to find adequate fitness/competitive swimming facilities, I was hopeful that
the city would use this upgrade as an opportunity to create a superior
swimming pool/environment I was much disheartened when I saw the first
plans, which on the contrary reduced the swimming opportunities~ That is
not a facility upgrade in my mind~ I don't know how much of the rec center
revenue comes from swimmers, but I am guessing it is a sigmficant
percentage, and this design certainly does not reflect that
The new pool design needs to take into consideration the needs of all users,
especially the large number of lap swimmers and master swimmers More lanes
are needed, not fewer A 50 meter pool would not be unreasonable -- I
believe that would significantly increase usage of the center from other
parts of the community as well as 7ust north Boulder.
I believe a number of other environmental considerations also need to be
taken into account for the pool For fitness and competition use, the water
temperature needs to be cooler than a leisure pool There needs to be
adequate ventilation (witness the recent problems at other local indoor
pools that have had to be closed because of health problems ) also, there
.~
,.,,
needs to be adequate separation between the lap swimming area and the
leisure areas I feel that the EBCC pool is almost unusable for masters
swimming, for example, because the swimmers can't hear the coach over the ~.
sounds form the leisure pool (even when nobody is in it).
Another pool consideration is the depth of the water A deeper pool is
certainly better for competition Also, many local runners (including me)
"pool run" to reduce running in7uries This can only be done in the deepest
part of the pool. The size of the deep end at the current NBRC pool is
completely inadequate for this purpose The longer deep end at SBRC is
better, but still not optimal, as only about 2/3 of the pool is usable for
pool rvnning A full 25 yard length of deeper water would be much
preferable
Small things about a pool design, such as the gutters make a big difference
in competition swimming, and at busy workouts, in terms of controlling
waves The pool designers should consult with experts in competition pools
I also look at this as an opportunity to learn from the mistakes made in the
upgrades to SBRC and EBCC For instance
Drinking water is very important in any fitness activity, including
swimming There isn't even a drinking fountain in the pool area at NBRC
currently Hopefully this will be fixed in the upgrade Also, many
athletes bring bottles to hold the water Chey consume during a workout
However, at EBCC, I cannot fill my 24 oz water bottle (a common size for
bicycle bottles) at any of the sinks~ I can 7ust get it under the faucet in
the sink at SBRC, and fill it most of the way Sinks with larger basins are
an important detail~
Something a non-swimmer wouldn't think about -- the ceiling design above the ~
EBCC pool is very difficult to swim backstroke under~ The ceiling at SBRC
is pretty good, because the beams are pazallel to the lanes But at EBCC it
is almost impossible to swim straight while looking at the ceiling Someone
with good eyesight and goggles can sight along the NBRC pool ceiling, but it
could be improved
The showers (at least in the men's locker room) at SBRC are quite inadequate
for a program like Masters swimming. The six shower heads might be barely
enough However, one is way too high even for me (i'm 6'3") One is way
too short for most adults And the showezs are arranged in the corners so
that it is difficult to use one corner units without blocking the use of
another
Parking is inadequate at SBRC, especially during scheduled workouts or other
events I always feel badly about having to park on the street in front of
the homes in the neighborhood
Think about the opportunities (including revenue) to host regional swimming
competitions at all levels with a world-class swimming center, similar to
the new center at DU Then contrast that with what might happen if a large
number of fitness swimmers start looking for other venues in the area The
upgrade to the NBRC might be considered a big waste if the number of users
actually declines~
I apologize for the length of this letter However, I feel that the issues
surrounding the rec center upgrade, especially the swimming facilities, are
complex It is worth spending the extra time now getting it right, because
.+~w
once the upgrade is complete much of these issues will not be easily
addressed later without ma7or rework Let's plan for North Boulder's
~~ current and future athletic commumty, including the swimmers, and feel
proud about the decisions that have been made
w.
I have not addressed budget issues related to any of these topics i do no[
feel like I have adequate information to comment on those issues However,
rest assured that, if the "upgrade" goes ahead as planned, and actually
turns into a"downgrade", that I will feel that my Boulder tax dollars have
been grossly misspent~
Thank you for your consideration, and feel free to contact me
Mike Ellis
303-443-2056
mike.ellis@tvguide com
1300 Kingwood P1.
Boulder 80304
CC: <Council@ci.boulder co us>
+`.r
^^"''
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